Comments on: Climate bigger threat than terrorism: poll (1)

By: Cynapse

Cynapse — Wed, 13 Jan 2010 00:13:36 +0000

Not at all. SL has a different point of view because of where he came from and how he was raised. I don’t always agree with him but I hear him (like Cynapse). His comments are always welcome here because we get the “other side of the story”.
It causes us to think and that is not a bad thing.

And that is ultimately what sets JNW apart from the predictable echo chambers that are most political blogs.

By: Jack

Jack — Tue, 12 Jan 2010 23:17:22 +0000

You're welcome SL. If I shared my upbringing people would have a heart attack. Not that it was wrong but little kids jumping on the cowcatcher of a 6000 locomotive steaming out of the local yard to catch a ride?

There was a time when things were very different and the local CN cop went nuts. Not that it bothered me but Dad was somewhat upset when he heard about it.

The point is that the "net" is changing things as people cancel their subscriptions and tune in to sites like ours. It's all good stuff and we need to keep it going.

By: stageleft

stageleft — Tue, 12 Jan 2010 22:54:52 +0000

@Jack: I was raised in a drafty old farm house by conservative (and Conservative) Baptist (of the good old fashioned spare the rod and spoil the child variety) parents on a small (300 acre) mixed farm (some dairy, some grain, some woodlot, and big family gardens) owned by my conservative (and Conservative) grandfather in New Brunswick very close to the American border (which was good because at the time the drinking age was lower on the other side than it was in Canada) where we got one fuzzy channel on TV. I went to small rural schools (grade 1 was actually in a one room school with six rows and six grades) until I was old enough to be bussed to the big town (population 650 at the time) down the road, we didn’t have a flush toilet until I was 15, and I didn’t have my own bedroom until the day I left home – when I did leave I went by plane, the first of my family to ever get on one (they were all quite excited about it as I recall)… yup, that explains it

– I guess maybe it also dates me a bit to ‘eh… oh well, it had to come out sometime.

I say that in a joking manner Jack, but it’s all not only very rural, very ordinary, and very mundane (for the times and the place anyway), it’s also all very true. My thoughts and ideas on politics and how any number of things do, or should, work have little to do with where I was raised or my upbringing, and everything to do with what I saw when I got out into the world on my own.

PS: Thanks for the compliment, I enjoy having my thoughts and ideas challenged here – there are darned few political sites where regular dissent doesn’t often result in being run off the property and I’m happy to have found yours.

By: Jack

Jack — Tue, 12 Jan 2010 21:51:01 +0000

Re: #12 -- "Ivory tower Stage. You’re just blowing your horn here."

Not at all. SL has a different point of view because of where he came from and how he was raised. I don't always agree with him but I hear him (like Cynapse). His comments are always welcome here because we get the "other side of the story".

It causes us to think and that is not a bad thing.

By: stageleft

stageleft — Tue, 12 Jan 2010 21:47:55 +0000

@John: People “self-select” to take part in polls. They do not, as far as I know, “self-select” to take part in specific polls where they know the questions before hand – so what is your point…. other than that you don’t agree with the results?

There was no arrogance in my comment, there was some snark directed towards you for thinking you know anything about me to be sure, but that’s it – me thinks you might be projecting.

By: stageleft

stageleft — Tue, 12 Jan 2010 21:42:56 +0000

@jt: I noted my qualifications to show John that his assumption of me being an “urbanite who knows almost nothing about internet service and computer connection times in rural areas” was utterly incorrect – it’s something that speaks directly to his point don’t you think?

Contrary to your assertion the article states that the “online survey was conducted among current members of Innovative’s Canada 20/20 panel, recruited from a wide variety of sources that represent Canadians by age, sex, region and language” – it is your opinion that they were carefully selected to attain a desired outcome, but that’s not backed up by anything but your other opinions is it?

By: John Luft

John Luft — Tue, 12 Jan 2010 17:45:26 +0000

stageleft….the simple fact is that the selection of respondents is NOT random. Your alleged knowledge of IT systems is not all that important. The fact is that on line polls (especially those that connect to people who have provided their email addresses) are not the least bit valid for the simple reason that they do not randomly select people. People SELF-SELECT by providing their email address. And your blather about “penetration rates” misses the point (as usual)…..Searching for information on the internet is not the same as doing polls. Any statistician worth their salt will pretty much laugh at your logic.

By the way…your arrogance pretty much tells me that I pegged you right from the start.

The poll is completely meaningless.

By: jt

jt — Tue, 12 Jan 2010 17:15:33 +0000

Ivory tower Stage. You’re just blowing your horn here. Who cares about your accomplishments, you seem more blowhardish when doing so. Besides, you seem quite prepared to make “biased” assumptions of anyone who posts contrary to you. You come across as a “credentialed” science is settled propagandist. On the science front, despite what you want to believe, science is not settled on a consensual basis, nor are wars of any sort.

What this survey seeks to do is browse the feelings of selected ISP living people and attempt to sway public perceptions on certain subjects, or reinforce them. Personally, these answers show that most of these people selected (and I could interject that they were “selected” carefully as per the expected response – a real scientific poll LOL) have never attained a critical thinking stage in their lives. They still believe what their media tells them to believe and the media reinforces that perception.

By: stageleft

stageleft — Tue, 12 Jan 2010 16:47:49 +0000

Well John, it’s pretty clear that you’ve made so really poor assumptions about me – don’t feel bad, it’s not the first time that sort of thing has happened.

Prior to moving to Ottawa I was the systems administrator for a small rural and remote ISP, and upon moving to Ottawa the first consulting job I had dealt with Internet delivery to rural and remote areas as a direct result of that relevant experience - so John, I know more than the average guy about the challenges and trials of Internet access and operating an ISP in rural and remote areas. I am also quite aware of what the rural and remote penetration rates (two years ago — ancient times in terms of the Internet — they were at 65% and climbing -vs- 76% urban penetration) and demographics are – social network growth rates (for example) are currently highest among older users with the 55 and older user age group reported to have grown by 514% in 2009. Facebook…. you know, that place where the No Prorogue group is growing like mad among the “elites” — is another good example where the demographics are shifting to the over 50 set. So generally I would say that your particular comments on that subject are — shall we say — what used to be as opposed to what is.

I’m not gonna take offense at your insults, your biased assumptions about me based on your lack of current knowledge about the state of rural and remote Internet penetration or general Internet demographics John, they are fairly typical of folks like yourself and generally bounce right off me – but they prove something, both to me, and the rest of those reading don’t they?

By: John Luft

John Luft — Tue, 12 Jan 2010 15:12:38 +0000

stageleft says (rather arrogantly) ”
“Exactly John, everybody knows ordinary Canadians, with ordinary Canadian values, and ordinary Canadians concerns, don’t have Internet connections or use email.”

Pretty clear that you are an urbanite who knows almost nothing about internet service and computer connection times in rural areas. Pretty clear that you aren’t able to understand that many of the elderly (who do tend to vote at pretty high percentages) do not use computers an awful lot. Also, pretty clearly you don’t have the mental capacity to understand that email addresses are (at least for those with any brains) pretty much private and are not broadcast widely to avoid receiving junk mail and Nigerian bank scam emails.

I wouldn’t expect someone with a name like stageleft to understand statistics or random selection. Thanks for once again proving it. Just to be clear….the poll is valueless because the selection absolutely ensures bias.

By: jema54

jema54 — Tue, 12 Jan 2010 06:36:01 +0000

The comments are quite illuminating – as are the one’s here. The msm cover up of Climategate was effective for a little while but the cracks are opening and a different flood is about to drown the ‘spinners’ in the msm. Nobody believes anything the goofies say – even if they want to believe. The dye is cast.